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Talk:Metroid timeline
More info This could use more information. It could use some reference to other events in the series, such as manga events, those described in manuals and in-game, as well as time placement relavent to each game. ChozoBoy 17:28, 30 July 2008 (UTC) http://gameboy.ign.com/articles/488/488084p5.html "Through that, we've created a story that is open to interpretation to the player, and as people play I think they'll interpret Samus' past based on what they take on those cinematics." Sakamoto, in his IGN interview, plainly states that Zero Mission has a story that is open to interpretation by the player. With that being said, it would not be official to have the game as part of the time line rather have it interpreted into the time line. Not to mention, Sakamoto does not refer to the game as a remake after this quoted sentence. http://metroid.jp/metroid_version2/history/index.html Looking at the time line on the official Metroid Zero Mission site, the dot for Zero Mission does come from Metroid 1; however, the dot for Zero Mission is placed after Metroid 1 on the time line. That contradicts the remake statement as well. DragonTetra However, the story in Zero Mission and Metroid I is almost identical (spare minor details). The second half of the game is simply an extension of Metroid I story with the zero suit. Both games tell the same story but different perspectives/lengths, and by that definition it's a remake. ''MetVet'' With that logic, I can say Super Metroid is also a remake of Metroid 1. I mean Metroid 1, Metroid Zero Mission, and Super Metroid all have basically the same story save some details. They all take place on Zebes as well. DragonTetra There's another problem with this page and that is with the Metroid Prime Hunters summary. Samus does not leave the cluster empty handed as she leaves with the Omega Cannon that she obtained in Oubliette. DragonTetra I don't think it is confirmed that she left with the Omega Cannon. It possible and highly likely that the Alimbic at the end may have taken it. Dark Ridley 01:24, 7 December 2008 (UTC) Okay just to cleaify Metroid and Metroid Zero mission are the same thing just with a slightly different design and( in my opinion) a much ending. Also when you look at all metroid games metroids seem kind of weak especially in the prime games. They just aren't that take over type of creature they were in the first two games realeased.Snore 16:47, 19 December 2008 (UTC) Omega Cannon It wasn't confirmed that Samus left it, but how could the Alimbics take it? They're only intangible spirits now. They can't physically take something. ''MetVet'' :On that theory the chozo ghosts also couldn't blast ridley off a cliff. Metroidhunter32 03:07, 7 December 2008 (UTC) ::True, but they were present at ghosts. As far as we know, the Alimbics were only a vision. ''MetVet'' Metroid Fusion Shouldn´t Metroid Fusion placed between Metroid Prime 2 and Metroid Prime Corruption? :Why? Metroidhunter32 16:52, 14 April 2009 (UTC) No, man. You have to sign your comments with 4 tildes (~), too. ChozoBoy http://metroid.wikia.com ADMIN (Talk/ ) 16:57, 14 April 2009 (UTC) Metroid Prime: Hunters has no place in the timeline. http://ds.ign.com/articles/616/616902p2.html Kensuke Tanabe: This game is its own universe, cut off from any other Metroid game, so there's no link between these characters and any game. We're going to start from this point with these guys. That's right. A spinoff. So why does this constantly show up in fan-made Metroid timelines? It has nothing to do with anything. Granted, in this very same interview, Tanabe also earlier stated that it seems to take place between Prime and Echoes, but this is a more powerful statement than that. Factor in that it never appeared in any official timelines, was not mentioned in the brief Metroid Prime Trilogy Collector's Edition timeline (which went over series chronology up until Prime 3), and does not further the plot of the series in any way whatsoever, and you've got yourself a non-canon game. 21:25, 30 August 2009 (UTC) Don't worry about it too much. There are plenty of Star Wars spin-offs that are still part of the canon. He's suggesting that the game is going beyond the more personal world of Samus than previous titles and is showing a new side to the universe that has been hinted at but not explored. Trilogy was probably packed to the brim already, and this story doesn't contribute a whole lot to the Prime story in the book, it would only seem out of place and confusing (since the book was meant to clear things up). A lack of inclusion doesn't cut the second part of MZM, the mangas, or everything after Prime 3 out of the canon, either. ChozoBoy http://metroid.wikia.com ADMIN (Talk/ ) 21:33, 30 August 2009 (UTC) Using Star Wars is a bad example since it's pretty much confirmed there are two differing continuities that fans follow (Lucas' movie-only canon, and the movie + extended universe is too confusing for me). Actually, that seems to explain why Tanabe may have two contradicting quotes. Well, the mangas are pretty much an in-depth look at Samus' past to begin with, and the "some Space Pirates escaped Zebes" line seems to imply that something may have happened without going into detail about it (and even then, the first Metroid Prime game was made with the first Metroid in mind). And I'm not saying Metroid II, III & IV aren't canon - they're clearly not mentioned just because the art book wanted to cover Samus' past and the Prime series' relevance. The fact that Hunters didn't even get a blip is iffy for me, given that Retro was involved during development and the least would have given it an honorary mention. 21:41, 30 August 2009 (UTC) Star Wars doesn't have two canons, it has levels of canon, to rule out contradictions in lower levels. I don't know how much Retro had to say about the packaging and art book, but I wouldn't have wrote about MPH, either, if I was trying to write a concise story that made the Prime trilogy clear. Like I said, don't worry about it. The games share the same publisher and are all popular so you don't have to worry about anyone forgetting them. Hunters probably got nearly as many trophies in Brawl as the rest of the Prime series did, any way. ChozoBoy http://metroid.wikia.com ADMIN (Talk/ ) 21:59, 30 August 2009 (UTC) On-topic with Star Wars... yes, there are indeed levels of SW Canon, but there are two different continuities generated from that - There's the film-only continuity, which George Lucas has full control over (and is the highest level of canon), and there's the extended universe continuity, which is pretty much all the licensed products over the years except in cases where they no longer apply due to new films or edits (in which case they're no longer canon) or where they are specifically alternate universe. Like I said, the EU is FAR too confusing for me since nothing seems to be constant, but Wikipedia has an article on Star Wars canon and has quotes confirming two main entities. But back to Metroid: Good point with the Brawl Trophies. True, Brawl isn't canon, but the fact that so many Trophies came from Hunters is an indication of creator intent (most game spinoffs in that game were lucky to have more than one Trophy representing them). And right, the art book isn't meant to go in-depth, so I guess it can overlook the Hunters storyline. There are no contradicting quotes anyway (that's the point when canonicity should really be questioned). And your explanation of Tanabe's quote does make sense - for example, before Mega Man 9 was released, Inafune (series creator) said that Rockman & Forte (basically Mega Man 8.5) took place "parallel" to Mega Man 9, which lead many to think that it was separate universe, but after it was released it still counted Rockman & Forte. So maybe translators easily mess up these kinds of quotes. 22:27, 30 August 2009 (UTC) You seem to know the series. Why not make a User name and help out around here? :) ChozoBoy http://metroid.wikia.com ADMIN (Talk/ ) 22:33, 30 August 2009 (UTC) Meanwhile, looking back at Prime... Looking back at Prime's Trivia Section, should we put prime as three years after ZeroMission(possibly ori. Metroid too?) Four tildes, Mp3c 03:52, August 19, 2011 (UTC) No. That information goes in Plot. 04:21, August 19, 2011 (UTC) Hey Friends *In the Metroid Prime Trilogy art booklet, it is stated that the events of this game take place three years after Metroid: Zero Mission. This does not mean that Metroid Zero Mission is before Metroid Prime, who may not understand that this is a continuity error, also if it were true because Samus in Metroid Prime 1 and does not use the Space Pirate Fighters with which escaped the planet Zebes at the end of Metroid Zero Mission.--BlackHAWX7 (talk) 15:48, July 29, 2012 (UTC) :One, please sign your edits with four tildes (~) or with the signature button. Also, this isn't the ONLY source for Metroid Prime being after Zero Mission. Nintendo Power had a timeline of the metroid series in an article about Other M, and there is the link at the top of the article. The MarioGalaxy2433g5 {talk/ } 15:44, July 29, 2012 (UTC) :I do not understand what evidence conflicts with this statement about Prime Trilogy coming after Zero Mission (aka Metroid 1, since it is a remake, one assumes?) Is there evidence prime came before 0? talk2ty 04:24, December 6, 2014 (UTC) Evidence Section I haven't found any definative proof displayed for the arrangements of this timeline, not that I am contending against anything in particular (except maybe "Hunters") But if there is any proper evidence to support arrangements of the timeline, (an example being the logbooks in the Prime games) It would be nice to put references/proof section. I plan to read through logbook entries myself later and perhaps add a little to the page (If not on here, ill just fing my games and look through them) 20:30, March 1, 2013 (UTC) Abbreviated list Although explaining each game and how it relates to the order in detail is cool, I feel like we should perhaps do a brief list at the start so people can see all on one screen the order of the games. For example: #Mangas (volumes 1 and 2) #Metroid (NES #Zero Mission (GBA) #Prime (Gcube) #Hunters (DS, Prime 1.5) #Echoes (Gcube, Prime 2) #Corruption (Wii, Prime 3) #Return of Samus (GB, Metroid 2) #Super (SNES, Metroid 3) #Other M (Wii) #Fusion (GBA, Metroid 4) #Dread (?, Metroid 5) Would also love to see an analysis of all the in-game evidence of the order proposed on this page. I get the impression a lot might be based on the out-of-game statements from developers? A separate page with a section for each game stating what proves 1 game comes before others would be super-interesting. Including basic evidence and then logical progressions from it. talk2ty 04:22, December 6, 2014 (UTC) Canonicity of Prime trilogy Have been reading some criticism that it does not belong with other games, that Prime trilogy might be own universe apart from some of the others like Other M, wondering if we could clarify source on this. Would like to analyze sources: http://metroid.jp/metroid_version2/history/index.html appears to go: #Metroid #Zero Mission #Metroid Prime (trilogy?) #Metroid II #Super Metroid #Metroid Fusion I actually don't see Other M there at all... or Prime 2 or 3 for that matter. http://www.gamefaqs.com/gamecube/589573-metroid-prime-2-echoes/faqs/31926 under "Metroid Chronicle": #Metroid #Zero Mission #Prime #Prime 2 #Metroid II #Super #Fusion Lacks Prime 3 and Other M like above. Prime 3 coming after Prime 2 is simple enough but I do think we need another reference supporting a co-existence of Primes with Other M. There might well be 2 timelines, for example: #Metroid>Zero>Primes>2>Super>Fusion #Metroid>Zero>2>Super>OtherM>Fusion This split-timeline thing is a little easier to understand with Zelda since there is Ocarina hijinx, but this has space travel so maybe wormholes screwed with things? talk2ty 06:50, December 6, 2014 (UTC) :I'm pretty sure those sources are only missing games because they're outdated. The Zero Mission site doesn't have Prime 2/3 and Other M because they were all released after Zero Mission, and the Echoes Bonus Disc is missing Prime 3 and Other M because they hadn't even been conceived of yet. As for a source on their co-existence: :Unless it's ever outright stated that there are two timelines, I see no reason to presume it to be the case. AmorphousBlobADMIN (talk) 07:02, December 6, 2014 (UTC) ::the problem with both of the above 2 references used on this article is that they were retrieved in 2005 so they were both pretty old. GameFAQs is from the Prime 2 manual and the metroid.jp history is probably even OLDER than that since it doesn't even mention Prime 2. ::I found http://forums.sega.com/showthread.php?344193-New-official-Metroid-Timeline-Prime-NOT-canon which links to http://gonintendo.com/?p=134762 an official nintendo announcement in 2010. It refers to the Prime series as a 'separate collection of games'. ::It also presents a Primeless timeline of: ::#Metroid ::#Zero ::#II ::#Super ::#OtherM ::#Fusion ::The Prime timeline exists on its own as ::#Prime/#Pinball ::#Hunters ::#Echoes/2 ::#Corruption/3 ::Based on this official 2010 division I think we should organize this page based on treating Other M and Prime as distinct things. We do not seem to have any evidence linking Other M and PrimeTrilogy as being in same universe. talk2ty 07:12, December 6, 2014 (UTC) :::The GoNintendo page isn't dividing them by timeline, it's dividing them by gameplay. Obviously, the Prime series is an offshoot of the main series- however, as I said above, it's been directly stated in 2010 by the director of Other M that they ARE NOT separate universes, merely separate parts of a single story. AmorphousBlobADMIN (talk) 07:23, December 6, 2014 (UTC) :::The Prime games are all canon and in the same universe as all of the others. (Kelis98 (talk) 01:06, June 18, 2019 (UTC)) Timeline problem Now first off sorry for my bad english ( im french ) next the first prime should be at least after super metroid because in one room of the pirate's frigate a scan on a computer says "Zebes has fallen. All ground personnel are presumed dead, either killed by the Hunter clad in metal or in the subsequent destruction of the underground facilities. Our research frigates Orpheon, Siriacus and Vol Paragom were in orbit at zero hour and managed to retreat." ( I took the source from youre site ) ''now this says that one zebes has fallen, two yes it is only says that the undergroud facility was destroyed but later in the text it is also said that some ships were orbiting around the area and manage to escape, and that showed us that actualy if those ship were too close from the planet they would've expload wich means that the planet died, and another fact that proof my toughts is that if the planet didn't actualy expload (that means we are after the first metroid) like you guys said well why would the space pirates saves themselves from zebes?? yes their master is dead but what makes them want to quit the planet? Moreover on the respective time line the space pirates need to stay there because normaly they need to construct another base on zebes. but they didnt because on the first prime its clearly said "zebes has fallen" they needed to retreat from it (because of the explosion of super metroid) so the correct time line should be metroid metroid 2 ros, super metroid, other m and then prime and etc respond me quick pls ^^ Tritri301 (talk) 00:12, August 14, 2015 (UTC) That is a metaphor for the destruction of Tourian. As confusing as it is, trust me. Metroid 1/Zero Mission takes place before the Primes. The Prime trilogy has Metroids in it, and the Metroids were exterminated in Metroid II. So if you want to have a lot of natural Metroids in it, it has to be before Metroid II. [[User:RoyboyX|'R'o''''''y'b'o''''''y'X']](complaints/ ) 00:18, August 14, 2015 (UTC) Well assuming she only went on sr-388 to destroy the metroids and not on tallon 4, that could entirely explain why metroids are on talon 4 and moreover it is told somewhere that chozos actualy made metroids and when you go on tallon 4 what do you discover : chozo ruins wich could lead to my point : prime is after other m or super metroid moreover it is not told if the space pirates took some baby dna on their ship around zebes but the closest you can get is in prime where it is sayd that they took metroids from zebes (in super metroid you didnt delete all the metroids because if the space pirates got the time to hatch metroids on zebes they got time to hatch them on their orbiting ships)Tritri301 (talk) 00:25, August 14, 2015 (UTC) respond quick pls ^^ Time line error explaination (part 2) Now lets imagine the 2 scenarios one with metroid prime beeing after metroid and the next where we place metroid prime after other m Please read this before "Zebes has fallen. All ground personnel are presumed dead, either killed by the Hunter clad in metal or in the subsequent destruction of the underground facilities. Our research frigates Orpheon, Siriacus and Vol Paragom were in orbit at zero hour and managed to retreat." ( I took the source from youre site ) this is actualy a scannable computer that tells you that. Metroid prime after metroid: Samus goes to zebes and destroy mother brain. For no reson the spaces pirates that were on three ships around the planet escape (first weird moment in this chronology because an under ground explosion doesnt do anything to a high altitude ship) but metroids were on board, so metroids are now remaining on sr-388, on the pirates ships and maybe on tallon IV so then she goes on tallon IV and sees that 1, metroids are from one of the 3 ships of the space pirates or 2 she sees that the metroids are from tallon IV because there was once a chozo civilisation (chozo created metroids so when theres a chozo village there might also be metroids its logic) she then goes on sr-388 and kills all the metroids there but theres remaining metroids on the space pirates ship so not all the metroids are destructed oh and also the baby metroid is remaining. so then (thats the next weird moment in this chronology) the space pirates try to steal to baby metroids when there are already plenty on board of their ship :/ but samus recover the baby and expload the planet ( now the remaining metroids are on the space pirates ship) then happens the rest of the story. now as you might have seen there is plenty of wholes and plenty of wierd things in this chronology now lets go foward with my chronology Metroid prime after other m Samus goes to zebes kill mother brain and get back to sr-388 (no weird momment in this crhonology so far) then she kills all the metroids on this planet exept for the baby metroid NOW the space pirates have a real motivation : the last living metroid (wich removes my idea of the chozo ruins having metroids) so they try to steal it (they stole it enough time to reproduce some) Samus destroy the planet NOW the pirates got a real motivation of quitting the planet : it will expload! but then theres metroids on board so they can reproduce them, they can place them on tallon IV and bla bla bla you see how the rest of the story is going.. My conclusion now thats fairly simple if you find a good agument (not such as "But man, this guy said" no i want a real logic explaination) to proof me that i am wrong good, fine, but i really think that metroid prime should or must be after other m Tritri301 (talk) 03:50, August 14, 2015 (UTC) thanks for reading respond me soon please Prime is between 1 and 2 Sorry my bad English, I'm from Metroidover, the Spanish version of this wiki. Tritri301, you're wrong, the Prime Saga is BEFORE Other M. It's between Metroid 1 and Metroid 2. It's official that the Prime Saga is between those games, Nintendo have confirmed it. The scan in Frigate Orpheon says "Zebes has fallen", but it means that Tourian has fallen, not that Zebes is destroyed. Moreover, Metroids are not extinct in the Prime Saga (in the Pirate Homeworld, in the Metroid Processing, you can scan lots of containers which had Metroids, one from SR388; moreover, in the Prime Saga any scan or logbook says that Metroids are extinct or Zebes has been destroyed). I repeat: Nintendo has confirmed (in magazines, for example) that the Prime Saga is between Metroid 1 and Metroid 2. In addition, if you have the special edition of Metroid Prime Trilogy, with the brochure that explains the Prime history, it's said that the Prime Saga is before Metroid 2. There are more explanations to say why the Prime Saga is between Metroid 1 and 2, but it's difficult for me to write them in English (if I could write in Spanish XD), but the Prime Saga is after Metroid/ Zero Mission, it's official. I hope I have explained it well, and I hope you have understood :).-- 19:27, August 16, 2015 (UTC) Well that is the kind of explaination i didnt want (Nintendo sais and this guy sais and you know....) but i guess ill need to accept that prime is between 1 and 2 :/ Tritri301 (talk) 22:09, August 16, 2015 (UTC) Chronology of Events? Perhaps we can create, or edit in, a list of events in chronological order, regardless of game? This page simply lists the games in the order their "present days" happened. Mugen Kagemaru 03:57, March 6, 2017 (UTC) : This is what I was hoping for when I came to this article originally. Unfortunately, I don't know that enough info is avalailable about specific events. I think a lot of things would go into the "Before Metroid 1" category. Could there just be a section about the events before Metroid 1, with a note that their relative order isn't clear? - Shockthetoast (talk) 02:50, September 29, 2017 (UTC) Timeline contradiction? (Super Metroid) So, i read through the timeline proposed here and agreed with most of it, except one games placement, that being super metroid. I don't think Super Metroid should be where it is in the timeline shown here, as placing it there causes a pretty big contradiction with the events of the games further back in the timeline. If Super Metroid is supposed to take place AFTER the prime trilogy AND Samus Returns, then why is Ridley suddenly organic again? By that i mean, why is he fully healed and 100% Organic, when the previous games (Prime 1, 3, and Samus Returns) established that he was a cyborg prior to that and still should be. Unless someone gives adequate explanation of Ridleys sudden reverse transformation back to being 100% organic, this glaring, contradictory plot hole makes me seriously doubt Super Metroid's placement on this timeline. Torak11 (talk) 02:24, September 20, 2019 (UTC) :For starters, [[Super Metroid (game)|''Super's exposition]] clearly shows (and narrates) both the endings of M/ZM and RoS/RS; that alone is indisputable. The only thing we're shown as to why Ridley suddenly changed back to fully organic is a shed mechanical arm during the post-credits scene of SR. --''Madax the Shadow'' {ADMIN} (talk • • ) 02:50, September 20, 2019 (UTC) :The prequel manga explains that Ridley has the ability to regenerate flesh (specifically, by consuming biomatter). This is visually demonstrated in Samus Returns, where Proteus Ridley is clearly more organic than either Meta Ridley or Omega Ridley; essentially, he's healed enough to an "in-between" state between the Prime Trilogy cyborg Ridley and the Super Metroid organic Ridley, at which point it only takes a logical assumption that he continued to heal in order to be fully organic by the time of Super. --PeabodySam (talk) 02:54, September 20, 2019 (UTC) :::: Oh, okay, i see. That makes more sense. The reason i had a problem with ridley being suddenly fully organic again is because, to my knowledge, his apparent ability to regenerate isn't stated in the primary sources of canon, the games. I admittedly haven't read the manga, manly because i can't find any physical copies. Though i admit, this conversation and delving into metroid lore has piqued my interest in the manga. Torak11 (talk) 11:42, September 20, 2019 (UTC)